Selling Your Construction Business? Succession, Wills & Exit Planning for Contractors | Freeman Group (IG Wealth)

0:00Our team at the Atlantic Construction Podcast is excited to announce our newest partner, Luminous Labs. Luminous Labs is the leading provider of architectural visualizations for developers, homeowners, architects, and more. Luminous Labs has a team of experienced designers and visualizers using cutting-edge technology to bring your 3D renderings to life. Using these architectural visualizations will give you a sense of scale, space, and design, allowing you to make informed decisions about your projects before construction even begins. These high-end architectural visualizations are a perfect tool for presentations, marketing materials, and

0:34design reviews, allowing you to communicate your vision to stakeholders, clients, and more. We'd like to thank our co-branded partner Procore Technologies. Procore Technologies is the global leader in construction management software. We look forward to having many guests from across the country from all different capacities under the Procore partnership umbrella. We'd like to thank our formal partner Payzant Building Products. Payzant has a 60,000-square-foot facilitation centre currently underway, as well as acquired a new location in Windsor. Lots of change and big news with Payzant, and we look forward to having

1:06them back on the podcast in the near future. Okay, welcome back to the Atlantic Construction Podcast. Unique episode today — one of many that we'll have with our partners at Freeman Financial under the IG brand. So we have Peter Freeman and Aaron Dressler with us today. Gentlemen, great to be with you today. Thanks for coming into the studio. Thanks for having us. Yeah, thanks for hosting us. So yeah, we're excited to dive into your motive to reach the

1:43construction industry, whether that's contractors, business owners of consulting firms, architecture, engineering — again, contractors of all kinds, suppliers, business owners that are at a certain level — small, medium, large — certain-sized businesses that need help with all kinds of their financial needs and decisions. And you're managing wealth. So before we get into more details, maybe we could just start with an introduction. Maybe we can start with you, Peter — just a little background on

2:20yourself, and then we'll go to Aaron and just sort of what you guys are all about and how you got to this point. Yeah, so I'm from Halifax, born and raised, which is cool — here like most everybody. And I joined the firm, IG Wealth, about 24 years ago. So initially I worked with colleagues of mine — I used to be in the retail Sobeys marketplace — and during that time I started working with that group as well as a lot of business owners. So

2:51now we're spending more time with our business owner clients, and we've been very busy in that marketplace, which we love. Thank you. Nice. Yeah, and yourself? For myself, I'm transplanted in Nova Scotia — came from Ontario, moved here 24 years ago. I've been in financial services now for 30 years. Did my rounds at a few of the banks, all sorts of roles, everything from loans officer, training officer, manager. Switched over to IG 15 years ago, where it was building a practice. I

3:29was in management for the first seven years at IG Wealth, and then for the last eight years it's been focusing on the practice, focusing on clients. So my entire career — or at least the last half of my career — has been focused almost exclusively on people who are either entering retirement or already retired. Right. You know, so for our listeners, I mean, you say entering retirement or already retired, but this is a journey of years and years of planning, right, to

4:01sort of do it right, for lack of a better term. Exactly — it's not a one-time event. You know, it's something where you plan to retire and just put it off, saying I don't want to worry about that yet. But it's not — not in the world of financial planning and wealth management. No, you know what, the earlier you can plan for these things, the better off you're going to be. Yeah. And you said you have a lot of military clients, or you had in the past, or

4:23you do currently? You know, living in Dartmouth, I'm right near Shearwater. I have a lot of military friends, yeah, and I started having a lot of military clients even when I was working at the bank, and many of them followed me. It just became something of interest — I really started learning about what the military members were going through. They have their own financial planning called SISIP, you know, and the

4:55benefits and the defaults that were in the SISIP plan, what their pension plans look like. For many military members, you know, they got into the military when they were 18, 19, 20. They're retiring before they're 50, and they're going, what do I do with my life? And no part of the DVA would help them kind of with that, or part of it. I was doing financial planning seminars at the MFRC — the Military Family Resource Centre — so we were

5:23talking to family members, and it was both the member and their spouses a lot of the time, so they would understand what's going on as well. So it became something of interest. I was involved with a boot camp that happened at Delly where they were helping military members who were leaving the military to start businesses. The boot camp had 20 to 25 people in it each year — almost a way to adjust back to civilian life. Yeah, civilian life. And military members are good with

5:55structure, you know, but there are other parts that they need. Their whole life is organized around such a high level of structure. Exactly. So there are other parts they needed help with, which are things like sales, marketing, how do you differentiate yourself. They're used to being part of a unit; now it's how do I make sense of my own identity, my own business, to grow it. It reminds me a lot of friends or stories I've heard of professional athletes when they retire and they have an identity crisis, and

6:24it's like a five-to-seven-year shift of their mentality if they don't get into broadcasting or stay in the industry. But who am I now? My identity's been tied up in this. We find it with a typical retiree as well. A lot of people — their identity is wrapped around what their job title was, their social network is wrapped around the people at work. As soon as they leave, it's like, who am I? Who wants to talk to me, all of a

6:51sudden? All those friends at work — they're not talking to me anymore. Every layer of their social, psychological — it's all yeah. What about yourself, Peter? You've got two kids? Three? Yeah, two boys, 15 and 17, and they're entrepreneurs themselves — they have their own little businesses. They're taking after you. Yeah, it runs in the family. And tell us about your time with Sobeys — that's a big name around Atlantic Canada. Just

7:20about your time working there and what it's meant to you. Yeah, everybody starts somewhere. In high school in Halifax, I was looking for a job, so I picked up a job at the local Sobeys store. I really got to know the manager well and understand all the aspects of the business. And when I ended up in finance and management at Saint Mary's University, everything came together. I said, gee, I work for a great company — I get to see the inner

7:51workings of it, apply that to what I'm learning in school. I really liked the Sobeys family and the way they did things, and the various businesses they ran. It was very exciting to be part of that group, and to work through the retail and work up the ladder a bit. And then after 10 years I realized I wanted to work with individuals and money — that's finance. So that's why I left Sobeys to join the firm, which I have. And here we are today. Right.

8:21So nice, nice. And I've heard that you've got some hobbies around the building — building things, lots of different things on the go. This is from your partner in crime here. Yeah, I do have a bobcat with a little excavator, and I'm a weekend warrior, so I'm always picking away at something — always building. Yeah, I find, you know, when you're on the business end and you don't get to work with your hands as much, I

8:50think a lot of our listeners may be able to relate. We're in an industry that's very blue collar, but if you're not able to — it's something therapeutic about just getting out and, whether it's woodwork and building a coffee table or working on the car or whatever it might be, just to get that kind of — I don't know if it's an affirmation — that you've got to get when you don't get it when you're not

9:16building things. So yeah, everybody has to have an outlet. That's right. We find that too with our clientele — when people retire, there's a lot of apprehension about what's next, and we spend a lot of time on that fear. Some of our business owner clients really don't retire — they want to, they just don't have anything that they know they can focus on. So when you build a

9:41very successful business, you've put your life into it — your heart and soul. In some cases it's your firstborn that you've nurtured. Yeah, that's right. So it's a massive transition for business owners to even consider and think and plan. But the sooner they plan, the more successful those plans become. So if we're going to break down the pillars of what you would provide as Freeman Financial — Peter Freeman, Aaron Dressler — you are under the IG brand, you're flying your own flag, this is a

10:15local company, this is a local touch — for our listeners that might be potential clients or that would be looking for a lot of help in this area. Is it succession planning for retirement? Pension? If you were to kind of sum it up, or is it just anything you need, we can help with? No, good question. Because people are going to think — a lot of times when we have these discussions — oh, it's financial management, it's a

10:47yeah, what exactly, specifically? Sure. So the challenge that we'll face is that for a lot of people, when they hear 'financial adviser,' all they think about is investments, and they miss all the other things that we do — whether it's talking to them about RRSPs, mutual funds, yeah, so exactly. They'll think it's just mutual funds, it's just RRSPs. We'll talk to people about tax planning, cash flow planning, retirement planning, estate planning — the risk analysis,

11:19there are all sorts of other areas that we're going to focus on to help them. We've often thought of ourselves as a connector for a lot of our clients to the resources that they need. If it's something that we don't do, we'll find other places that can help them. But we do a lot to get people, I will say, from one stage of life to another stage of life in a way that is the most comfortable for

11:48them. So it's unique for every individual — they have specific needs. They might not be thinking about a succession plan; let's not focus on that. It's more investing and attention for their business, and then their personal finances where they're at. Exactly. We'll deal with different business owners and go through our process. First meeting, a lot of times, it's getting to know about them — what are their goals, what are their likes, what are the things they're looking for? Like a first date. Yeah,

12:17it's like a first date. And then it's like troubleshooting — saying okay, what are the things that you've done well? It's almost like doing a SWOT analysis for their business, right? What are the strengths, what are the weaknesses, where do we see some things that should be changed? We'll often talk to not only the business owner but their accountant, their lawyer, about making some changes for them, because we'll spot something that doesn't look right, and

12:43no fault of the accountant or lawyer — could be something that was done perfectly 10 years ago, it's just outdated now. Things have changed, and they should be making some changes, because what was put in place 10 years ago doesn't make sense anymore. So we'll see that. And then we'll look at all aspects of what they want to do. And then it's multiple appointments over multiple years, even. Not just like, yeah, okay, well, I need to talk

13:12to a financial advisor, go talk to one, and everything's fine. This is not a one-time, long-term thing. Some of your clients you've had for 20 years? Exactly. Oh yeah, exactly. Peter's been at IG now 24 years, and like I said, I've been in the industry 30, and we've had clients who have been with us over 20 years. It's lifetime relationships. We've taken on their kids as clients. We've got some of the grandkids

13:45as clients. The biggest thing those clients are looking for is how do I pass on the wealth to the next generation? I want to make sure my family's okay. What's the best structure for that? And trust is also penetrating to further generations, even in your career, in your lifetime. We have a lot of clients who we started working with to start planning for retirement — who were, say, early 50s —

14:15you know, they're 55 or whatever — introducing us to their parents, because they want to make sure the parents are doing everything right for estate planning purposes and everything else too. They're worried about what their parents are doing, and with a lot of, I'll say, senior scams and everything else that are out there, they want to make sure their parents are protected. So they want a second opinion that everything their parents are doing is correct. And we've had those

14:43introductions. So when it comes to business owners, it's an extra layer on top of what you normally see from the personal side. From a business owner perspective, it's what's happening with their family, how do I pass on things to their children — but also how do I support my management team, how do I support the other employees. There's a whole bunch of people that are involved. It's far more complex when it comes to succession planning, and

15:15a lot of business owners — we already mentioned the business is their baby and they want to take care of it. So is it safe to say that if you're helping a business owner with their business, at the same time you're also helping them with their personal finances as well? It's not like, yeah, I have a client here but this one we just help with their business, their personal finances were elsewhere. It's all usually the same. It's usually the same. You

15:41know, the business is their personal stuff — it runs over. Even most of the time, when we're using our financial planning software, it has everything that combines their personal and their business side all in one. So they can see what happens if they make changes to the business of passing money to the personal side — whether it's taking dividends, salary, etc. — how does it impact both sides of the equation? So we often are

16:09almost always, I would say, dealing with both sides. I can't think of situations where it's only the business and not the personal side. Yeah. We find a lot of our business owner clients — most of them come to us by referral, so they have a good understanding of what we do. Some of the business owners that we meet, who look us up online and find us, have an expectation that we have to diffuse. So usually that first meeting, as I said,

16:38we've spoken to people for as long as 10, 12, 14 years just to get to know them, because they'll say, well, I'm going to sell my business in five years or 10 years. Well, you want to have that relationship now. So we will have — we have many people we talk to who are there to consult us, but they get to know us. And some people call us their dream team because we have that relationship — we've

17:05never done business, they've never written a cheque for us, we've never charged them anything. We've dropped in to see them once a year — how's your business going, how's family, how you doing — and it's building up that relationship and that trust. Because when a business owner sells their business, most times all of their assets are in that business. Sure, maybe they own their own home and they have a cottage, a few cars or something, but a lot of times their retirement is locked up in that

17:34business. And it's a scary time. A lot of people work longer than they probably need to, partly because they don't understand, or they're too busy in their business. They're almost afraid to consider retirement because their business has provided them with a steady paycheck, and they don't have the investment experience to say, oh yeah, I'm comfortable to sell my business and give someone my money, and I'm comfortable that they're going to give me the income that I need when I retire. So we build that relationship, we

18:02build that trust, and we educate folks and say, look, these are your options when the time comes. And it's not as money-and-numbers-oriented as some people might think — it's really the relationship side. Now, we have all the planning software, we have university degrees in business, we understand all that stuff. But a lot of those details are worked out between the accountant, tax lawyer, estate lawyer — we can hammer those details out, but

18:34most of our clients are really not that interested in the numbers. They're interested in: can I retire? Who's going to care for me? What happens if something goes wrong — if I get sick, if I die? Are the loans paid? Does my business transition? Who's going to run my business? Will a competitor gobble it up? All these concerns — we've seen them, we've worked through them. And if there are things that people need to know, just ask us. That's what we're here

19:02for. We're here to educate people. One of our clients often sends us a lot of referrals, and I said, why do you keep sending us all these people? Like, every few weeks someone's calling and asking questions. And he said, well, you always make me feel good about the decisions I've made. I've made a lot of big decisions in my life and consulted you on them — you and Aaron — and they've always been good. I've never

19:28felt bad about those decisions, but even though I didn't fully understand them at the time, you guys pointed out the things that were important that I needed to know to make those decisions. So we're educators — that's what we like to do. Yeah. I want to try and come at this from a devil's advocate and play the role that I can play, which is my background in growing a business in contracting and being immersed in that industry of

19:58you know, it's fast-paced, it's all-consuming. You've got employees, you've got any number of things you've got to deal with. I think a lot of entrepreneurs — I'll use that term, so it's specific — that could be a contractor, could be an owner of a building supply store, it could be any number of things. But you're running a ship, so to say. And I think a lot of the mentality — and I'm trying to be specific to the construction industry, but there'd be a

20:32lot of overlap to any industry — where on that side of things, I felt less than competent on the financial end. There's this feeling like, oh, if I own a business or if I'm involved in management, I need to know everything about finance, and I don't. In fact, I don't know near enough. But that isn't true — you shouldn't know everything and you can't. And you're often the personality type that is out there creating business in the construction and contracting world. I

21:12mean, your head is full of opportunities and you're navigating opportunities, you're picking the best one, and then you're creating a system that works so you can provide material and labour and whatever else. But you're not supposed to know necessarily what to do with all the profit that's made — or that isn't made — when you have those problems. Because making money is a problem that needs to be solved, right? So I think there's a mentality out there, and there's a stronghold

21:40that you've got to break through for some of these people. It's like, maybe I've had bad experiences, or I've got to trust these people with my money. So why you guys? Why you as opposed to whether it's IG or a bank with a financial advisor from RBC or Toronto-Dominion or some other financial intermediary — why you? Because eventually I've got to hand that over and say, I need you guys to take care of this for me. One of the

22:08main things that I think our clients can relate to is the fact that Aaron and I are business owners. Freeman Financial is a company — Freeman Group is incorporated. We are just like everybody else out there. We are business owners, we face the same thing everyone else does. What are we going to do when we retire? We have a succession plan — we have a great succession plan. But I think a lot of people need to realize

22:36that if you run a successful business, it is never ever because you know everything about everything. The most successful business owners know everything about what they do every day, and that's only a small part of the wheel. And when I mean a small part of the wheel — you don't mean unimportant, you mean that's just one part, right? Exactly. And a lot of business owners, once we get to meet them and know them quite well, they say, gee, you know, I don't really

23:05need to worry about the financial side anymore. You've confirmed with me that my accountant is doing everything right. We had to make some changes with the lawyer, but that was great — she was happy with that, and everything came together. We just never really had the time to talk to her about it, but you guys brought that to the forefront. So a lot of our business owner clients thank us, which seems obvious to us, but they thank us because they're so engrossed

23:31and so focused on what's flying at them every moment of the day that they think there are these other things that are probably out of control, or they don't really understand it that well, or they just don't know enough about it. So we're that connection point, the financial quarterback, and we say, okay, look, this is something you need to do before the end of the next quarter. Don't worry about anything else — your accountant's going to look after that, your lawyer

23:57will do that. And if some business owners don't have those folks, we can introduce those relationships. We can recommend people that they can work with that are suited to their industry or their specific type of work. And if they have people they're already working with, we're more than happy to get to know them — and we know quite a few of them around the city anyway. But again, business owners have to remember, if they're running a successful

24:21business, it's because they're doing the right things. I've used this analogy with different business owners at times: there are all sorts of service providers you've used in the past. You have an accountant because you don't want to be an accountant yourself. You have a lawyer because you don't want to go through law yourself. You have a dentist, you have a doctor. You trust those professionals because they're experienced in their roles. We're just another one of those — we're experienced in our role, we're not

24:52expecting you to know everything about finance. We expect you to know everything about your business, not necessarily our business. We're going to try to educate you on as many things as possible, but it's impossible for you to know everything about our business. It'd be like saying you should know everything about being a doctor or an accountant or a lawyer — it doesn't make sense. So focus on your business. That's what you're made of. We're made for the financial side — this is how we're going

25:19to help you. Yeah, because even further to that, in our industry — and I'm going to talk about it more from a subcontractor perspective — you could be in landscaping, or you could be in building envelope, roofing, cladding, interiors, drywall, millwork, flooring. There are companies doing millions and millions of dollars of revenue. The owners came from the job site, they know the work, they know the business, they know the pulse, they know how to get

25:46to work and make money — that's who they are. They're people people. They've got the vision, they've got the drive and the grind. But when they think of accountants, lawyers, these different people in the structure of a corporate enterprise, they're thinking of bookkeeping and accounting. So where do you fit in? It's understanding financial engineering — what do I need a lawyer for, what do I need a financial advisor for,

26:23what's my accountant for? There's a lot of things there that you're not talking about with people who came through an MBA or a business degree or who are really paying attention to these different pieces and what they mean when it comes to managing a business and money. So there's a hesitation — there could be a level of threat, a level of mistrust,

26:51a level of, oh, you know, who are these guys in the suits and ties coming to tell me what to do with my money? This is what will happen in the process. Yeah. Like, call it the education process — we'll sit down with some people and say, here is the role of your accountant, or a good bookkeeper, or depending on what

27:19you need for your business, here is what a lawyer should be doing for you, and here's what we do. And sometimes these people who are outsourced, or coming to see them once every month to do the books, are not doing what they're supposed to. Exactly. And that's the education — it's saying, you know, for your business, this is what you need from that role. We are not going to be your bookkeeper. This is what a bookkeeper is going to be doing

27:42for you. This is what your accountant is going to be doing for you. Because bookkeeping and making credit and debit entries is a lot different than telling someone what to do at the end of the year with the amount of profit they have — whether they should pay cash for something, or save this, or donate to this for tax reasons. That's all completely different in terms of what our roles are. So we'll often work with those other professionals, and we'll often say, isn't it great you

28:06have a team of people around you that could be helping your business, so that everybody has their function and we're all looking out for your behalf, all trying to optimize what we do to make your life easier. It goes back to what you said — successful business owners, people who are really good at the one thing their business does — that's what they focus on, and then other people are placed in positions where they're the experts. And that

28:37takes a level of humility to do that. We look at it — a lot of us want to be good at things we're not good at, especially things we wish we were good at. We look at it in our own practice. We're running a business and we talk about roles within our business. We have a few administrative staff, and Peter and I could spend our time doing paperwork — that's not the best function for us. The best function for us is going

29:02out talking to clients, educating clients. We've got an admin team, and we'll talk about — is one person on our admin team's role to make sure our clients are booked for regular meetings? Is it another person's role to do all the administrative paperwork? Is it another person's role to make sure our website is up, social media, events that we host — that people are invited to? So we'll make sure people have an

29:33idea of what their roles are. And in a business — in construction and such — it's the same thing. You're not doing everything. You've hired people to do certain things within your business. Yeah, which is why a startup is so difficult — depending on your capital, you've got to wear all the different hats, at least at first. One of the things I would say makes both of us unique, where we're coming from, is that both of our parents owned businesses. We

30:03grew up as kids seeing what our parents went through — the struggles, what it took day to day, the long hours, the sacrifice at times. It's in our DNA. We grew up like that. Our parents had different businesses. And it's in your spirit — that's the reason they call it the entrepreneurial spirit. More than just ingrained — you don't have a choice if it's there. We'd like to welcome our newest partner here at AC

30:36Media — the Freeman Group. Freeman Group Financial works closely with business owners, professionals, and retirees as their primary custodial wealth manager. The Freeman Group is targeting contractors and people in the construction industry as they move forward. The Freeman Group is a great choice for all your financial wealth management with a local touch. We look forward to having the Freeman Group on our podcast several times throughout the next 12 months with specific financial educational episodes. Soubliere Trinity is Atlantic Canada's newest drywall and interior contractor. Soubliere Trinity is a

31:07joint effort between Trinity Energy Group, local Division 7 experts for over 17 years in Atlantic Canada, and Soubliere Constructors, a highly reputable commercial interiors company based in Ottawa since 1986. Soubliere Trinity has been performing work on commercial projects throughout Atlantic Canada this year while planning for more growth in the years to come. We'd like to thank our partner Pivot Accounting. If you're a contractor, a small-to-medium-sized business owner in the construction industry, and are looking to outsource your payroll, accounting services, and financial needs, Pivot Accounting is a

31:37great option. Exactly. Growing up, I think both of us always thought — it may not be that we go into our parents' business, but we always thought we're going to be running something, we're going to be involved in some type of entrepreneurial venture. It's our DNA. It's just how we operate. More than anything else, what are you thinking? A lot of things. Aaron and I, you know, we're

32:09— I was going to say we're mutually exclusive, but we certainly think the same way, which is great. And another thing is, I've realized in my career that for me to be as successful as I wanted to be, I needed to be in a partnership. So Aaron and I joined in partnership in late 2018, and it's amazing because we complement each other. I've said this for years to clients — you know,

32:38you need a complementary team. And I can say I understand it so well now because I've met Aaron. I've had some different partners over the years in the business, but Aaron — we know what each other's thinking, and it's exciting. That's why we really love business owners, because, like I said, we are business owners. We work together and we recognize that I don't know everything. There are things that I don't know, and I'm not afraid to say I

33:06don't know everything. I learn something every day. What I don't know, Aaron knows. And if Aaron's not sure about something, he'll flip me a text or a message and I'll jump right back. I've got the answer. And if I don't have the answer, I'll tell them — I'll say, you know what, it's been three years since I've had that question asked, and some things change. So let me talk to one of our accountants and let's just double-check that. So it's a lot of

33:28fun. We have a lot of fun at work, we have a lot of fun with our clients, and we do a lot of social stuff too — we get to know people on a personal basis. I think that's crucial. We have a vested interest — we don't do well unless you do well. Our clients have to do well for us to excel and succeed. So to see them succeed — we're not paid salaries, we don't charge people by the hour.

33:52It's a different process that we derive compensation from, but it's a mutually beneficial relationship. If a business owner client of ours is doing well, the better they do, the better we do. So we have a vested interest. We're always pointing things out to clients — have you considered this, have you thought about that? Yeah. And it's a holistic approach, right? You're getting to know the client — personal, business-wise, all their unique issues, whatever level of

34:21complexity — and you're solving problems, and you're both wanting to get the win. It's a joint effort, it's a team. There are many times that business owners know perfectly well we don't know the business as well as they do — definitely. They are the experts, they've been running their business 20, 25, 30 years. But they'll use us as a sounding board. They'll say, guys, we trust you — I was thinking of doing this, what do you think?

34:50And for some business owners, the only person like that they could rely on before was their lawyer or their accountant. Now they go, okay, there's also you guys. What do you think in terms of going this route? And we get those types of questions from time to time. We'll say, we're not the expert in your business, but what you're saying makes sense. Or, financially, it does or it doesn't. Or, your idea

35:19sounds great — where do you want to bring it? What's the next stage, and then the next stage, and then the next stage? Kind of like the CEO, or the visionary, going to their accountant or their CFO and saying, hey, do we have the money to do this? And it's like, no, we don't. Or, yeah, do that. Exactly. Or, I don't like it but we do, or whatever. So sometimes we've been put in

35:41that role. And they like using us as a sounding board, sometimes just for life issues more than anything else. Money is a life issue for everyone — it's part of our existence. Yeah. We learn a lot about families — obviously it's confidential — but the concerns they have about what's going on with their children, potentially with their partners, with whatever else, and

36:11it all plays in. It's pretty intimate. And we'll talk to them about it because it's like, okay, what's top of mind for you? And sometimes it's not even about the business — it's something else that's going on. So let's get it out there, let's talk about it. Yeah. So, again, in business, when you're a business owner, it's people that you're dealing with — whatever the service

36:34or the product, it's people that you're in contact with. And that really is what your business is. So you end up being somewhat of a counselor, to some degree. We all have to be — we wear many hats. Counselor, therapist — we all need a little bit of counseling, we all have to do a bit of that. We've said it many times: we're the jack of all trades when it comes to the hats we wear. Sometimes we have to be the

36:58enforcer on different things, sometimes it's the sounding board, sometimes it's the psychologist — it's all sorts of different things that encompass the role. Yeah. So for our listeners right now that are followers of the Atlantic Construction Podcast and Atlantic Construction Media — what would be, not necessarily a target client, but the optimal client for you both, or for Freeman Financial, to take on or engage with? Is it a contractor doing $20 million in revenue, say,

37:40in whatever capacity, whether that's a civil contractor or maybe a smaller GC, or a consulting firm? What level are we talking? Or is it like, we can help anyone of any size? Who's going to get the most value? Let's talk a little bit about that. Good question. Because we're an established practice, we have the luxury of not having to go out and sell something. We don't have sales

38:13quotas or targets. We're in this business from now on out to simply help people. We will talk to any business owner or entrepreneur that's looking for some guidance. And the reason we do that is because it's a small area — everybody knows everybody — so we want to try to help as many people as we can. Now, realistically, not everyone's going to become our client, and most people may not even need our service. They may say, well, you guys, I can see where

38:48we're going to be butting heads right now. You're helping me figure things out, or you're going to give me some troubleshooting right now. But maybe down the road, when you sell your business, that's when you become a client. But initially you can run things by us, or you can reach out to us. And we can say to you, you know what, this is a question for a chartered

39:11business valuator, and we happen to know two in the area — which one would you like to call? So we're kind of a sounding board. A lot of times, we don't want people thinking we only deal with clients in a certain bracket. Sure, most of our clients that are coming on now are selling businesses, and those businesses are producing north of a million dollars in assets. But everybody has to get there. So if people in

39:44our listeners have questions — they aspire to be there or they want to be there — then it doesn't hurt to call us. We're not going to charge anything. We can give a little bit of free advice and push you along in the right direction, because that's what we want to do. We live in Atlantic Canada, we want to see Atlantic Canada do well. And we recognize that not everybody is there, not everybody is saying, okay guys, I'm going to sell my business next week, I have a

40:12cheque for $25 million and I don't know what to do about it. That needs to be a confident decision — that decision takes years to make. So yes, we have some people that we've met, and six months later they've sold their business. But they've come on referral — from an accountant or lawyer, someone who says, look, these guys have a vested interest in how well you do, you want to talk to them. That's great for us, and that's an easy

40:39way to meet people and an easy client to pick up. But we want to earn that client — ethically, we want to earn that business. That's why we're willing to talk to pretty much anyone who needs a little bit of guidance and just doesn't know. They may think they have a silly question. A lot of people say, oh, I've got a really dumb question or a silly question. We haven't heard one yet — I'm waiting for it.

41:02I've been waiting 24 years and I haven't. Yeah. I was just going to say, when you asked the question, I was trying to think who gets the most value from us. And I would say — because we're so used to dealing with people's children who aren't born yet — people's children, they definitely get the most value, for sure. But we sit there and we have a lot of clients that are retired or about to retire, and those are the

41:34clients that usually have the questions that mean the most. They're thinking about the next generation, or two generations down. They have complicated issues. They understand that they need to talk to somebody to answer their questions, because they don't know the answers, and they may not believe their accountant or their lawyer is the best person for that. So those are the people who look out and say, they're probably not the best person for that. So I'll give you an example — we unfortunately

42:06have had some clients that have gone through health issues. Their accountant and lawyer aren't necessarily providing insurance protection for them — they're definitely not. But they need to ask us questions about, how do I protect my management team? I want to make sure they're stable. If something happens to one of them, I need to replace them — where's the funding coming from? Those are the types of questions they're going to ask us, and they get value from those types of

42:33conversations — just, how do I keep the business running even if somebody is now out of the picture because of illness or death or whatever else? When it comes to the actual succession side, all sorts of tax questions come up. That's where we'll get in a room with the accountants and actually figure it out. And we may bring in even head office resources to say, here's an optimal approach to

43:04the succession of your business — whether it's how you're going to split up the shares, how you're going to sell the business, are you selling assets or selling the shares, etc. So those are the people who typically will get the most value from us. Yeah. I'm trying to think about the umbrella of construction — especially for us where we have guests on who are in the residential space, and most of our guests come from the

43:30ICI world, meaning industrial, institutional, and commercial construction. It's so broad — on one end of the spectrum you've got a supplier of heavy civil machinery, and then on the other end you've got a small architect. Then you have a GC that maybe not many people know about, but they're doing all kinds of builds under $5 million across Nova Scotia, New Brunswick. And then you've got your big players and developers in the downtown Halifax core, and you've got Newfoundland, PEI, New

44:04Brunswick — there are so many different businesses under that umbrella. I don't know what most people think when they think construction. Do they think a guy with a tool belt on building a home? Probably, is what a lot of people think. No, I mean, it's a massive sector. We know, on average, it's estimated that 60 to 70% of businesses are going to go through some type of succession or close down, unfortunately, over the next decade.

44:34And probably more so within the construction sector, with the stats we see on the labour shortage — where certain people will be retiring, what are we doing to bring new apprentices in? But it's also the same thing with owners. Exactly. In the next five to ten years there will be succession planning that should be underway, if it's not already. Right. Exactly. When we have clients who are teachers, for example —

45:02they're prompted to attend a retirement seminar anywhere from three to five years before they retire. And we kind of approach business owners the same way. That's a rational approach — saying, three to five years before you even sell the business, you should be doing a hard look with a professional on what to expect. It's both on the financial side and the psychological side of retirement, so that you're actually prepared to go. So the people who

45:35get the most value — it may not be a specific segment of the construction industry, but I'd say it's broad-based among the industry — those type of people who are ready to go, three to five years beforehand, that really need to have a conversation. Yeah. Well, just comparing it to any one of the past 65 guests we've had on the Atlantic Construction Podcast, it would just be — I

46:04mean, it's anything from management of national and multinational corporations to a local paving company recently from New Brunswick, or a general contractor. So I also think there are a lot of people coming to my mind as we're talking — just in my circle here within the local area — who are doing between two and five million in revenue. They're probably making five to ten percent margin, enabling them to keep going every year. And some

46:40of them — they're all subcontractors. It's cladding, it's civil, it's painting — all kinds of different scopes of work as a subcontractor. And there are a lot of those individuals in my mind because they've improved from the type of business where it was a mom-and-pop shop, or they've grown and taken over as the next generation. But some of them are still on the job sites a little bit, then they're in their truck, then they're invoicing in the evenings. And they're doing, you know,

47:11they're doing well — doing millions in revenue — but there's not a whole lot of structure, not a whole lot of back-office. They're just totally immersed. So there are a lot of people in that space that could really benefit from — whatever's holding them back from getting in touch and sitting with people like yourselves. Yeah. Up to this point, sometimes they'll blame it on lack of time because they're so busy. But really, the answer is: you're too busy not to do it. Right?

47:41Exactly. If it's a priority, you sit down with someone. You know, it's the type of thing where you started as a mom-and-pop operation with two or three employees, you've grown to 25 employees, you've gone through transitions in your business, it's become more complicated. It's like navigating life — sometimes you've got to know where you're at to know what the next decision is. Right. Exactly. Yeah. So we'll sit down with them over a cup of coffee and have these

48:10conversations — and it's to ground them, just to say, what's important to you? We can say, on average, there are some commonalities that we usually come up with. A lot of business owners do want to give back, for example — they want to give to their community. Part of it is beyond them at some stage. So yeah, you're impacting the community as a

48:41whole, and you're also doing something positive for their taxes in that specific situation. Exactly. So we'll start having discussions with them — how do you protect your staff, how do you protect your children, how do you give back to the community? Both Peter and I are involved in different events where we've given back to the community, and

49:06we're involved in community events and we sponsor things, because we want to see Nova Scotia be a better place. And we see that from business owners far more than your typical employee — business owners control more, and they have the resources to do more. We want to help support that. And sometimes it's just coming up with some strategies where we can magnify those benefits and those donations. So a lot of people

49:39— we try to remind them, don't worry so much about the numbers, that's our job. We'll talk to the accountant, we can figure that out. It's the concept, it's the dream, it's the goal — those are the bigger things. But we'll say to somebody, what if you were to be more charitable? What would that look like? If you wanted to be charitable, what are your parameters? So we basically tell people what the speed limits are. We say, look,

50:06there's a 50 zone here, there's a 100 zone here — in other words, these are your abilities. A lot of people, like I said — business owners who are deep in their business — just need to get an answer or a direction. Sometimes there are different types of accountants. Someone says, oh, my accountant's really good. Great. But your accountant doesn't give tax advice, and they don't charge you for it — in other words, you're

50:33paying them for preparation and filing. You're not paying them for tax advisory. Oh, I guess that makes sense. So don't be upset with them because they didn't tell you what to do, because that's not what they do. A lot of times people are asking us simple questions like, is my accountant any good? Absolutely. But their partner, or someone in their firm, needs to talk to you about planning — not that person, because that person is just for year

50:59ends or GST or whatever aspect you're looking at. We have a lot of experience just by virtue of working with people, and we want to share that. We want to make Nova Scotia — Atlantic Canada — prosper. We want to share our knowledge, share our connections, and just help business grow. We want to help people realize their efforts when they retire and eventually transition out of their business and maximize their value. Yeah. And I'm trying to come at this again as a

51:34business owner — what are people thinking as they're tuning in, listening to this conversation, kind of sitting here at the table with us, who know they need some help? Let's start with the basics. It'll be something as simple as: have you ever sat down with a financial advisor? Do you even know what the experience is like for your business? Because there are some that haven't, for sure. And

52:00there are many that haven't. And then it becomes: how about you spend an hour, just an hour of time, just to learn what a financial advisor may be able to do for you? And then you could take it from there to see if you'll have value from that conversation. Being self-employed and working with self-employed individuals, our hours are not nine-to-five. We often work in the evenings — we try to avoid the weekends, please — but we do a lot of evening work.

52:34So a lot of folks are like, I'm just really busy, or my day starts at seven. Well, okay, we'll call you at 6:30, or we'll drop by with a coffee, and we'll go over it with you and just show you how it's a lot less complicated than you think. We do a lot of evening work, and I guess that affords me to take a morning off if it's nice out. But we understand business owners

52:56have unique needs, and we cater to that as much as possible. We also offer people online — if people want to have a Teams call or a Zoom call, that's perfectly acceptable with us. I actually have a client that we've never physically met in person. I think we onboarded during the pandemic or something. Exactly. Probably scare him if I told him I wanted to see him in person. But yeah, he's very comfortable working online. He's in

53:24Ontario. We do work with people across the country. Some of our business owners are Ontario-based, and they're just as comfortable working online. So we do offer that. We meet in person — our main office is in the Halifax Shopping Centre in Halifax — so we have a lot of meetings there. But I'd say probably 40 to 60% of our meetings can often be at the workplace. We will travel to

53:50see our clients there. And we want to get a feel — how can we really understand you if we haven't put safety glasses on and steel-toed composite boots and walked around your warehouse? If we don't really know what you're doing, we want to see it. We'd rather meet people at their workplace than their home, to be frank, so we can see what they're faced with every day. Yeah, I'm sure that's part of the

54:15thing that makes it exciting and interesting and invigorating — you get to learn about these different businesses, where you're helping with this one part that's so essential. You get to learn about the services they're providing. It could be any number of things. And we just want people to understand — look beyond the fancy suit. We're just

54:39regular people like you. We're no different. We don't talk about how many degrees we have in our education. We're certified financial planners — CFPs — and in good standing, obviously. But we don't need to talk about designations and degrees and all that. That's not important. What's important is that we understand you, we understand your business, we understand what your needs are. Once we understand what your needs are, then all you need to know is that we're qualified to

55:06do what we do. We've got a great track record, we're highly experienced. But none of that matters. What matters is that you're comfortable to talk to us and tell us what's on your mind. And there's never a silly question — ever. It just makes us feel smart if we know the answer. Yeah. But even if we don't know the answer, we'll get back to you with that very quickly. So yeah, I think what excites us — with our media

55:29platform being partnered with this vertical of financial advising and bringing that to our audience, to this industry — is that it is a problem that needs to be solved for a lot of businesses. Especially there are certain ones where the value level is much, much higher. We're talking about large firms, local companies — there's a local element here. Even people that I would say are colleagues, not just acquaintances,

56:05that I'm thinking of — I want them to sit down with you guys. And why not you guys? There are other people they could sit down with, but with the experience level, the motives — you're wanting to reach this industry because you've both reached a point in your careers where you've reached that level of success, and you want to give back, you want to plug into

56:32more clients within our industry, because it's a cornerstone of not just the economy here but the culture. There's a lot of growth and activity in this industry. But that's also going to mean that there are a lot of people that are in over their heads. When you have problems, you're navigating life or business, you don't know what the next step is. Sometimes there are a number of things that need to happen, but

56:57sometimes the one thing someone needs — it's not just about the financial returns. It's the mental energy, the peace of mind, that comes once they start to talk with you. All of a sudden their energy's freed up to deal with this other problem and these other problems. And things start to go from just getting a little bit better to all of a sudden there's like a whole new vision that comes clear. So sometimes these problems that

57:24you don't understand how much they're weighing you down — because your financial situation is kind of just all over the place, splattered everywhere, not tightened up — and you've spent the last couple of years like 30% less productive, because this big part of your business and your mind is not right. These are serious issues. This is stress that continues and continues if it's not dealt with. But a lot of people just have to sit down and

57:53start the conversation. Right. Yeah. Business in Nova Scotia, Atlantic Canada, even across the country — small, medium, large — but more so smaller businesses, because that's our demographic. The average size of a company in Canada is less than three people. I didn't know that. Yeah, it's a startling statistic. You think of the big companies — they only have 20,000 employees, or — but there's not that many of them. So basically, business drives our future. If we want to be cared for when

58:24we're elderly, people need to be employed. We need to create employment, money needs to move around. Our objective has always been to leave this place with an impact — leave this world with a positive contribution. Whether you leave money to charity, or leave money to family, or create jobs while you're here, or enhance people's living experience when you renovate their homes — everybody's doing something important, no matter how

58:58small and insignificant it may seem. Our objective is to add efficiencies to anyone that we can. We may not always be the ones to execute that, but people can run an idea by us and we can point them in the right direction. Yes, you're going in the right direction — keep doing that. We've seen that before. Just keep going that way, you'll get there. Sometimes it just needs a little bit of a push. But again,

59:27our objective is to make people understand: hey, we're all in the same situation. We've all grown a business, we've all matured a business, we all have to sell — all these things we've all gone through together. That's why our business does very well, because being self-employed, building our own business, working with business owners — that's the business we understand. And I want to draw a thread on just the mentality shift I think within

59:55our industry locally — maybe more so — of the more collaborative approach to business, to construction. The kind of dictatorship mentality that you might have seen more so in the older generation, from the Baby Boomers and on — now it's a lot more like, we need to come together, we need a win-win situation. And that's what your motive is here, right? We need to sit down and we want you to win. We will only win

60:30if you win. And if that's the case with all these relationships, then everybody wants a win and everyone's headed toward the same goal. That's right. We want to share our knowledge and have it applied where it's going to benefit the most amount of people, have the most impact. That's why we've sort of shifted, I think, to work almost exclusively now with business owners — because that's the engine, that's

60:58really what's going to keep things going. And if we have knowledge, we want to share it or direct people to where they need to go. We want to add efficiencies — that's my word, 'efficiensize' — we want to help people maximize and get the most out of their efforts as possible. I've always thought of it as: a lot of these businesses are scattered throughout rural Nova Scotia, and they may have five, ten, 15 employees. If anything

61:31happens to that business, it hurts the community. So we want to do our best to make sure that these are long-standing businesses, that they pass on correctly, that they stay within the community, and that they're successful within those communities. That's one of our internal goals when we're talking to people — to make sure that these things last. Because a lot of rural areas have been hurt, and we want to make sure that they're

62:00still there — these small towns and stuff. Yeah, no, you're right. They are staples in the community. And you could take the biggest example of that in the downtown core of HRM — I'm not going to start to mention companies, but there are companies that people in rural Nova Scotia just don't hear about if they don't live there geographically. But anyone who lives there, if it was to disappear — I'll give you an example, and

62:28it was many years ago, and Peter was highly involved in this: Bowater Mersey, down on the South Shore, when they closed. It's a huge plant, and all sorts of people all of a sudden were unemployed, and they needed advice. It's one of the reasons Peter's got an office in Liverpool. It was about talking to a lot of these people that were coming out of Bowater Mersey and saying, what are your options — will you be okay?

62:59And such. We realize the impact in a community. So I think — go ahead. Sorry, no, I was just going to say, funny you mentioned Liverpool, but that's just a little bit about what we do. We have an office in Liverpool, and it's a community conference centre, so it's sort of open to people who want to use our boardroom or whatever. It's complimentary — they can use it for different things. And there's a

63:26— most municipalities now have rural transit. In the valley you've got King's Transit and point-to-point, and different places. On the South Shore there's Queen's Transit, point-to-point transit. I think they charge a — they try to collect some revenue from their passengers, but it's all government-funded, obviously. And anyway, we provide them with free space — they have parking, internet, Wi-Fi, heat, lights, and I don't know, 800 square feet — and they use that complimentary. So we want to

63:57give back. There are lots of little things like that that we do. They can stay there as long as they need — 10, 20 years, who knows. We do want to give back. And like I said, I think it's a collaborative effort. If businesses are struggling in an area, a lot of times we've connected some businesses with other businesses too. We've said, look, you're struggling in this area — here's another business that kind of complements you, you may want to talk to

64:19that person. Sometimes it's just having those serendipitous conversations. But again, we want to leave this place as a better place. And there are struggles with demographics, retirements, wages, salaries, and the biggest one, I think, is labour shortages and skill shortages. We want to try to encourage people — Aaron's involved in some different things — but we try to bring

64:49Youth, and we want to bring those people in. Having small businesses succeed and continue to operate and flourish is our mainstay. Yeah. And as you're talking — and as Aaron mentioned this situation where these people were going through a tumultuous time and the fear of what's going to happen — what we

65:18were going to do — I was thinking about our province here in Nova Scotia and, you know, Atlantic — it's the Atlantic Construction Podcast — and in our industry specifically. But think of what's been happening, especially this past year, with just the natural disasters, fires and floods. And I was drawing a thread with what you mentioned earlier, Peter, about long-term relationships and business, using the analogy of marriage. It's like you want to be able to have those tough conversations and fight it out in a

65:46healthy way, and that's going to make us better. But there's a stat — I think from the American Psychological Association — that the number-one leading cause of divorce is financial problems. Just the anxiety and fear, these strong emotions that financial problems cause. You mentioned the fear that was around that, and transitions — what's going to happen, am I going to have enough money? The people who just lost

66:14their homes in the floods here. And they're wondering — is my insurance going to cover it? How long is it going to take to repair? Is it even going to be able to be repaired? So, business owners — they're essentially owning that risk, taking on that anxiety. That's why they're the CEO, that's why they're the founder. And they've got a heavier burden to carry in some regards. Definitely. But

66:42it's such a — there are so many inner battles. A lot of people out there that are listening right now, in our industry or any industry, are hurting, and financially they're not sure what's going to happen. They're living with that every day, they don't have the help they need, and there are all kinds of problems around it. These things weigh on people mentally and emotionally — it's

67:13so taxing. It destroys relationships and businesses and families. Yeah. I'll tell you, it's important work that you're doing. I'll give you one example where you really see the emotional side of it. Last year we had — I think it was eight clients that passed away, which is more than we've ever had in any one year. I was going to say eight and a half, but no, eight. Every time that happened, some of them

67:46— we knew the people were ill, they may have been elderly, whatever. Some came as complete surprises. And the emotional side of helping their families get through all of that — it's like, oh my God, what has happened, how do I handle it? They're dealing with grief, but then the financial side hits and they're going, I don't even know what the first steps are I should be taking. And we'll walk them through, because everybody's throwing advice at them, and

68:14telling them what they should do or shouldn't do or whatever. It's like, pause, let's work through this — what makes the most sense for you? And from a number of these people, they were long-term clients — we were really close to them, they were like family. We were at the funerals. We knew the spouse, we knew the children. And it's — we're

68:43showing up and we're grieving as well, but we're trying to put our professional hat on and saying, we'll walk you through this. We're going to hold your hand, give you a hug, and help you through the process. And that's where we really see that whole emotional side kick in — when a life-changing event has occurred. Yeah. I guess what I'm trying to get at with making those statements is: one's

69:12relationship with money in general — yes, as an individual, as a human being, as a business owner, as a person who also has family dependents — it's a strong pull. And not everybody's relationship with money is as healthy as it should be, in different ways. And there's a lot there to draw out. Sometimes it's even talking to people who feel they have everything done perfectly. I think of one client at the time — he said, no, I've got everything really

69:43done, I don't need to talk to you. And I said, well, I wonder why so-and-so said I should talk to you. And he said, well, probably because I've got everything done perfectly. I said, well, that's awesome. But let me take a look at it now that we're here. Enjoy your coffee. Let's take a quick run at things. And anyway, I pointed out something to him about his insurance, and it was significant. Anyway, he ended up

70:06passing away, and I think the hardest day of my life was handing the $750,000 cheque to his wife. And she said, well, what do I do with this money? I said, it doesn't matter what you do with it — what matters is that you're going to be okay. I said, your husband made the right decisions. He had proper insurance, and everything's going to go well. And she said, oh, you brought this insurance cheque. And I said, well, yeah, it was just something

70:34that your husband had overlooked, and I corrected it. And she said, so you're saying if you hadn't looked at this, I wouldn't have this cheque? And I said, well, sure, I guess, yeah. And that provided her with a lot of financial support through her life. That means she doesn't have to rely on her kids. It was just a small oversight on her husband's part. And he was a successful business owner — or he was before he died. He's not an

71:00insurance expert, he didn't know that. A lot of times, just by looking at things, we can point out some things. He said to me at the time, oh yeah, you just want to sell me insurance. And we joked about it. I said, yes, I do make a commission. I said, no matter where you go for the insurance, someone has to be paid. And he said, well, I don't mind paying you because you pointed it out.

71:19It's probably not really costing me any more money — the way we were arranging things, it was actually cheaper to put this insurance in place. But anyway, we have several of those situations. They're our toughest days, delivering those insurance cheques. But it's a good feeling when you know that someone's looked after, and you know that the person that's left this world isn't looking up at me saying, hey, you didn't protect my family. So we

71:43— that's important to us. A lot of times, looking down on you. Hopefully. Well, that's right. Yes. But that's important — that we've done our job. People are so busy in their business that they just say, oh, I'll get to that, I'll get to that. And a lot of people don't have a will — just simple things

72:05— and they're not that hard to figure out. Sometimes it's just an obstacle, like, I haven't asked this person to be my beneficiary yet, or my executor. So okay, let's do that. A lot of times Aaron and I will say it to a client: your Christmas gift to your wife this year, or your husband, or same-sex partner — get a will, power of attorney, healthcare directive. And get that on file, so if you get wheeled into the ICU

72:30they already know who to talk to and who's going to make those decisions. So a lot of these things that might scare people — it might seem overwhelming, a very difficult thing to do. And obviously, if less than 50% of people have those things done, they just say, I don't want to deal with that right now. That's right. And the truth is — and I'm kind of a stats person — it's somewhere around 50% of people don't have a will. Now, the reality of it is, everybody has a will

72:52— it's written by the province. So the province decides what happens to your money. Is that important to you? And a lot of people don't realize how easy it is to get a will done. It's really not that big of a deal for some people, but it gets put off. And again, all these little things that people carry around — carry around a backpack full of extra weight — oh, geez, I should get that done. Let's talk about it, let's help you, let's

73:14get those things done. It's not that much downtime. It increases productivity when you get all those things looked after. Something as basic as a will — I can't tell you how many times I've said to a client, do you have a will? Yes. Does your executor know where it is? And they're like, I don't even know where it is. My lawyer — no, exactly. And I'm like, okay, well, you're gone — you can't help them answer that

73:39question anymore. What do you think you're leaving behind? Or, there's a will, there's a way. You know, you're making a mess for that person to clean up — trying to find this document that may have been in your old house. We have to get these things organized. We joke with people on some of this, but it's serious stuff. It'll have an impact. It's so serious you've got to joke about it. Yeah.

74:06Well, I think there's a level of embarrassment too. Sometimes if things aren't going well in the business, or, do I even know if I have a will? There is that kind of — because it's such a key part of a person's dignity in some regards. I don't want to reveal all this stuff. I don't want anyone to see what's going on under the hood here. It's not

74:29that great. So people have to kind of get over that too, to get some help. Yeah. People have to realize — and our listeners, you have to remember — speaking for myself, not talking to anybody else: we can all improve. Aaron and I are constantly taking courses, upgrading our skills. We have continuing education — we're always trying to stay ahead of things, and we enjoy it. It's what we like

74:57to do, so we have fun with it. But sometimes there are things where people just don't know where to start. For us, education is easy — here it's listed, pick the courses you want to take. It's easy for us. But a lot of people — do they have a power of attorney? Do they have a will? Do they have an estate plan that's really going to work? Sometimes you talk to people and their executor — oh, he's dead, you

75:19know, I did my will 20 years ago. Well, don't be embarrassed about those things, but don't leave that to your family. That's not how you want your family to remember you when you pass away. It's not a question of if. I mean, when you're young, in your 20s or 30s, it's if I die. Well, when you reach a certain point — and that's different for everyone — maybe I'm not going to be able to avoid that, am I? Exactly. Mortality sets in, yes. But eventually you

75:44realize, hey, at some point I'm going to pass away. And the biggest thing you can leave to your heirs or the people that are left behind is leaving things done right, so they're stress-free. That's probably one of the biggest things we see. People think, oh, I've got everything done. And I'm like, yeah, no, there's one thing you need to do, and we can help you do it. It's not that big of a task, but we need to have a proper estate

76:07plan. Because that's what you want — things to go smoothly. I love it when I sit down with a client — I mean, I hate it when someone dies, but I love it when I get to sit down with the family and say, this is probably going to be the easiest estate to administer possible. And they kind of look at me and go, oh really? Because it's just — Dad had all these businesses, Mom had this business — and I'm like, no, no, no, we've got it all nailed down. And

76:28they're like, oh, all you have to do is this? And they think, is that that easy? Like, I'm the executor and you're telling me that's all I have to do? Yeah, because we did our job and we organized everything. And sometimes that's a huge relief for people, because they know they're going to die at some point — you never know when. Death and taxes. Exactly. So if we can quantify that stuff for you or help

76:50people reach that goal, that's what we want to do. We want people to run their business as efficiently as possible. We want the standard of living in our country, and more specifically in our communities, to be maintained. We see a lot of problems now — you look at dozens of countries around the world in turmoil right now. There are coups going on, gangs, violence — it's unbelievable.

77:18And yeah, huge wars and stuff that's never going to get resolved — countries that are going to be in conflict in perpetuity. That's probably my only fear in life: what can we do to protect ourselves? Immigration is awesome — we're bringing lots of people in here with new skills, and that's great. But we need to keep the focus on employment. If people want jobs, we've got to

77:44provide them. And as small business owners, you might think you only have one or two employees — you're not contributing. Yeah, you're the backbone of the country. So, what is a big company? What do you mean by big? Exactly — maybe three employees. But then those three employees shop at another institution or store. We're all integrated. And people sometimes think, well, my business is not that important. It is — everything is important, every little

78:12bit. I think of it like a steam locomotive — I'm intrigued by trains. You know, a steam locomotive is a 500-ton beast rolling down the track, and if one little bearing overheats and fails, it stops the entire train. There's a derailment. It's like the ecosystem, right? You take this species that no one ever thinks about, and it affects every single part of the life cycle. You warm the temperature of

78:41the ocean — you warm it up — yeah. So the reality of it is, you can't worry about the things you can't control. Worry about the things you can have an impact on that you're not doing anything about. And if you don't know where to start and it's somewhat financial-related, then reach out. And I just want to reiterate the point — yeah, sure — call us, text us, email us, get a hold of us

79:04somehow. That's fine. But we always recommend that people who talk to us also talk to lots of people — get a second, third, fourth opinion. The more you talk to people, the more you're going to learn, the more you're going to gain. Your reputation is everything. That's right. We can't help everybody, we can't be everyone's advisor. Admittedly. So we can recommend other people. Bounce it off somebody. You don't have to talk to us — talk to anybody. But

79:31you do want to look at professional experience. You want to say, is someone a certified chartered accountant, or are they just calling themselves an accountant when they're a bookkeeper? You need to do a little research there. And when you are getting professional advice, make sure that person is qualified to give that advice. And I think what's exciting for us at Atlantic Construction Media — with this partnership, this is an intro, this is a podcast based around

79:59financial advisors and who Freeman Financial is — Peter Freeman and Aaron Dressler. Our attempts with this partnership are to reach the people that can use this assistance. And there'll be future educational content that we'll be focusing on — it might be estate planning, might be tax, it might be succession, might be insurance. Could be any number of things. And we'll have more content, more podcast episodes, various marketing content coming out

80:32on the financial front that we hope is beneficial to business owners that are tuning in, who need that help. And then in turn they'll connect, and we'll see these relationships happen in the future that are needed and are going to be a big help for a lot of people that we're there to advocate for. We're passionate about this industry, and so it's going to help people in a

81:01lot of different ways. And because we can't be all things to all people — even if after this podcast you reach out to somebody else, or your own financial advisor, or your financial institution, that's what we want. That makes our day. You don't have to call us. You just need to take action and reach out to a professional or people that you need. So if you think you need to get your will done and you know a lawyer, or you have a client or an affiliation

81:29with a lawyer — you worked on their house or whatever — talk to them. Don't be shy. Everybody started out at the same place. Our objective is for everyone to do better. We want to see you benefit. You spent time listening to us today — take action, talk to someone, make those things happen. Any final comments? No, I think Peter said it all. That's a pretty good job. Yeah. Well, thank you both for connecting with us, engaging with us.

82:06Our partnerships mean a lot to us. This is an important service for a lot of our audience and for our industry in many regards. So this is exciting. It's good to have podcast number one with Freeman Financial recorded, and we look forward to lots of future content. Yeah, it's been a great conversation today. Glad to be back. Good to be here. Thank you. Thanks. We'd like to thank our longtime sponsor Cook Insurance. Cook is your trusted insurance broker in Atlantic Canada for

82:3850 years. The Cook team opens up opportunities for contractors by proactively managing the requirements of their bond facility. They expand levels of support and negotiate preferred rates, all while prioritizing ease of doing business. A NAVA Award partner since 2020, Cook is one of the largest construction brokers in Canada and offers national strength with a local touch. Whatever your insurance needs are, Cook has you covered. The team at the Atlantic Construction Podcast has been able to build a strong relationship with the folks at FCSA. FCSA is strongly invested in

83:07supporting the Atlantic Construction marketplace and helping contractors to build their businesses. We highly